Howard Dean endorses Socialist candidate

Dumbass pinko-nazi-neoconservative-hippy-capitalists.
Embar Angylwrath
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Post by Embar Angylwrath »

Ddrak wrote:Aabe,

The problem with the free market is it isn't necessarily optimal. If you remove assistance from the airlines you instantly lose United, American and USAir. I can't even start to predict the economic ramifications of that, but I'd be willing to bet there's plenty of non-US airlines that would benefit from the collapse of the US players.

Dd
Just because it isn't "optimal" choice doesn't mean it isn't the best choice in a given circumstance. Sometimes "optimal" isn't practical or available.

And you're right on one point, you can't predict the economic ramifications of losing three airlines. But if the capitalisti ceconomic model has shown anything, it has shown there is opportunity in chaos. I'm sure Jet Blue and Southwest are thinking the same thing.
Correction Mr. President, I DID build this, and please give Lurker a hug, we wouldn't want to damage his self-esteem.

Embar
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Post by Beestyall »

Ddrak wrote:The problem with the free market is it isn't necessarily optimal. If you remove assistance from the airlines you instantly lose United, American and USAir. I can't even start to predict the economic ramifications of that, but I'd be willing to bet there's plenty of non-US airlines that would benefit from the collapse of the US players.
I'm curious, what kind of support does JAL, Luftwansa, KLH/Delta, Kwanis, etc. get from their respective governments? To listen to the airlines, they've been loosing money since the dawn of time (or the 1980s). At some point don't you just need to let them die and be reborn?? It's getting to be like giving aid money to the Somalis and being shocked when the warlord of the week blows 90% of it on crap.
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Post by Kulaf »

Smaller carriers survive due to clear focus on their niche. They could not hope to full the role of the big 3. When UPS went on strike Fed Ex and DHL could not come close to holding their jock.
Embar Angylwrath
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Post by Embar Angylwrath »

Yet check the stock prices of those three.
Correction Mr. President, I DID build this, and please give Lurker a hug, we wouldn't want to damage his self-esteem.

Embar
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Post by Ddrak »

Which 3? US Air and United are junk stocks at the moment. American is doing a little better.

Free markets don't necessarily provide the best solution to infrastructure problems is all I'm really trying to say, and there are cases were it makes a net positive for a government to prop up a business that is losing money and has little to no chance of ever recovering. Not often, but it does happen.

As far as I know, most of the world's airlines are substantially government subsidised - especially once you break out of niche markets.

Dd
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Re:

Post by Partha »

FOR depriving us, in many Cases, of the Benefits of Trial by Jury:

FOR transporting us beyond Seas to be tried for pretended Offences:
Be still, my irony detector.
Embar Angylwrath
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Post by Embar Angylwrath »

Ddrak wrote:Which 3? US Air and United are junk stocks at the moment. American is doing a little better.

Free markets don't necessarily provide the best solution to infrastructure problems is all I'm really trying to say, and there are cases were it makes a net positive for a government to prop up a business that is losing money and has little to no chance of ever recovering. Not often, but it does happen.

As far as I know, most of the world's airlines are substantially government subsidised - especially once you break out of niche markets.

Dd
Was replying to kulaf's post. Fed-Ex, DHL and UPS. Check the stocks on those three, and evaluate them in light of kulaf's argument.
Correction Mr. President, I DID build this, and please give Lurker a hug, we wouldn't want to damage his self-esteem.

Embar
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Post by Kulaf »

UPS
73.85 per share with 1.126 billion shares outstanding

Fed-Ex
87.60 per share with 302.1 million shares outstanding

DHL
Well this is tough as they are a german subsidiary of DPW so I am not even gonna bother.

Last reported figure I read was that UPS handles roughly 70-80 percent of all package freight in the U.S..
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Post by Ddrak »

Embar,

Apologies. Makes sense now.

One thing I will say - the FedEx dispatch centers are an impressive network of machinery.

Dd
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